[Geowanking] 3D geodata for Dublin?

Wed May 9 14:27:44 PDT 2007

Hello Tine,

I am forwarding your request to a group of mappers, here, that may know 
of some resources for your project  ( below)

Cheers-

Mike

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: 	Re: [ppgis] 3d geoweb - Digital Earth - reference model
From: 	Tine F. Ningal <tningal at gmail.com>

Hi Mike,

i  My research is on modelling air quality at street  level in the inner 
city of Dublin. To model the the ambient air flow in the streets, a 3D 
GIS is a prerequisite. That means a 3D footprint of the buildings and 
street configuration. to get such a data is almost impossible and that 
means one has to create the data from scratch.

I am sure there should be 3D data about this somewhere, or if not an 
easier way to go about extracting the building/street forms and deriving 
the height values. I have Quickbird images over the study area which is 
60 cm resolution -very high. However, it would take a long time to 
digitize all the building accurately as there are shadows and also, 
zooming cannot go down to certain thresholds. The images are in tiles 
and there is no overlap so no stereo can be acieved through 
photogrammetry modules in image processing applications like Erdas, Envi 
or others.

I have tried to extract heights from SRTM 90m DEM but the resolution is 
big. The idea was to propagate the DEM heights to the buildings. The 
only option I am left with now is to collect elevation points either 
using GPS or from existing topographic maps. I am still exploring ways 
to derive heights from the Quickbird images, also automatic or 
semi-automatic feature extraction.

If you have any ideas, tips or experiences to share on extracting 
features and height from Quickbird I would be more interested to know.

Regards and cheers

Tine Ningal
UCD, Dublin, Ireland

On 5/4/07, *Mike Liebhold* <mnl at well.com <mailto:mnl at well.com>> wrote:

    Dear Friends, ( please forgive cross posting )

    I've been thinking a lot about 3D GIS lately, about interoperability of
    3D objects in real world - virtual worlds like Google earth, Microsoft-
    virtual earth, NASA wwind, ESRI ARCglobe, companies like Autodesk have
    large legacy 3D GIS &CAD systems still moving forward, and  no doubt
    someone like Linden Labs will launch a 3d social apps in a real world -
    virtual world..  based on geo coordinates instead of 2nd life's random
    geography, and even mobile 3Dgis is quickly showing glimmers of
    promise:  mobile augmented reality developers will  likely build  a
    geocoded 3D frameworks to hang links on... for services like nokia's
    MARA prototype ( http://www.technologyreview.com/Infotech/18291/)
    ... and
    a consensus 3D geoweb like GEON  (
    http://www.geongrid.org/about.html <http://www.geongrid.org/about.html>)
    will also be the basis for the worldwide sensorweb, eg. for
    trans-disciplinary problem solving like macro-ecology, climate models,
    zoonautic, ( animal born disease) emergency response, &&

    Will we have multiple 3D geowebs?  beyond harmonized 2D geodata and
    geocoded hypermedia, will 3D data  and media producers and service
    operators have to produce  and manage multiple frameworks ( including
    places, buildings, things - people& avatars ) for each or these
    environments?

    So,  following digital earth, champion, Tim Foresman's lead  - (As
    Director of Digtal Earth programs for NASA working for vp gore, Tim lead
    the first  DERM  - A reference model in the Federal Geospatial Data
    Committee and ISO communities in collaboration with the original NASA
    led Interagency Working Group on Digital Earth.   That work is now off
    on a dusty shelf, out of date, given  the future requirements.)

    I'll be leading sessions at Where2.0
    (http://conferences.oreillynet.com/where2007/) and  ISDE5
    (http://www.isde5.org/ )   to raise questions leading to  re-starting
    considering of a consensus reference specification, for a 3D geoweb - a
    a standard Digital Earth.  google, no doubt,  sees kml as the answer to
    these questions, and MS is, no doubt  brewing up their own
    too,  clearly
    the big guys are going to duke it out from very proprietary
    perspectives, and it's still not clear that the US gov, OGC, W3C, OR
    SIGGRAPH communities like x3D focusing on vrml, offers the integrated
    perspective of the participatoryGIS, FOSS4G and digital graphic arts
    communities, here, capability to develop  detailed optimum requirements
    from wide perspectives:

    Let's start again considering, as communities,  a meta level layered
    architectural description for unified earth and geo-related computing,
    refining a model including the following topics ( and others) into an
    ideally coherent and rigorous framework for optimally sharing and using
    data across all web, geospatial and scientific contexts:

    * geodesics, where experts are still refining descriptions of the shape
    of the earth, and where new coordinate systems are argued.
    * sensor data generation and labelling
    * geodata and hypermedia coding/decoding/transcoding
    * open source networked geodata -libraries and feeds- of raw sensor
    data, streaming media, tiles, 3D objects , 2Dvectors, polygons, points,
    text, etc.)
    * geo metadata models - formal ontologies, logical description, as
    frameworks for mining informal users' tag systems
    * geo server and middleware models for efficient saving, searching, and
    sharing of all kinds of geodata
    * sensemanking inference and other spatial intelligence
    * rendering  software for combining many sources of geodata into
    unified
    useful views for many kinds of interaction
    * user software/ sharing/saving/serving/searching/rendering
    * human interaction systems,  avatars and social nets,  gis, mobile gis,
    3Digs,  geoaudio, augmented reality, haptics
    * autonomous sensor networks processing geodata.
    * meta scale geosciences exploring large transdiscipline problem spaces
    like planetary meteorology, large scale ecosystem modeling,
    human-ecosystem interaction models, large scale,  emergency
    response,...

    These are just penciled place holder layers of a hypothetical reference
    model - that will need to be refined by the appropriate communities.

    I  have no idea how to organize a coherent dialog between the e-mail
    list communities cc'd here. right  now, maybe somewhat  loosely
    connected dialog will be fine. later perhaps starting at where2.0 and
    ISDE5, maybe some kind of 3D geoweb wiki communities will coalesce to
    start organizing these consensus interoperable models.

    See you in San Jose and Berkeley!!

    Mike

    Mike Liebhold
    Senior Researcher
    Institute for the Future

    The Open Forum on Participatory Geographic Information Systems and
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-- 
------------------------------------------
Tine F. Ningal
University College Dublin
College of Human Sciences
School of Geography, Planning & Environmental Policy
Richview
Clonskeagh Road
Dublin 4, Ireland

t. +353-(0)-870613344 (Mobile)
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